Let’s look at the Euclid Space Telescope..
Show Notes
- The Euclid Mission Overview
- Mission Location and Challenges
- Science Goals of Euclid
- Spectrograph and Redshift Measurements
- Significance of Mapping Dark Matter and Dark Energy
- Preliminary Data Release
- Model Simulations and Real Data Comparisons
- Future of Euclid’s Mission
Transcript
Human transcription provided by GMR Transcription
AstroCast-20241104.mp3
Fraser Cain [00:00:49] Astronomy Cast Episode 732 The Euclid Mission. Welcome to Astronomy Cast Our weekly Facts base, A journey through the Cosmos, where we help you understand not only what we know, but how we know what we know. I’m pretty keen. I’m the publisher of Universe Today. With me, as always, is Dr. Pamela Gay, a senior scientist for the Planetary Science Institute and the director of Cosmic Quest. Hey, pal, how you doing?
Dr. Pamela Gay [00:01:09] I am doing well. I’m not sure how it is Grant writing season. It is a presidential election year. And the leaves. My goodness. They need wrecked. I am in denial of so many things. How are you, Fraser? That’s the real question.
Fraser Cain [00:01:26] I’m good. And you know, I talked about this before the show, but but we are getting back with the virtual Star party. We’ve got just an incredible generous offer from an organization called Star Front. They host telescope co-location down in Texas and they have set aside a telescope just for me, just for the star parties. And so last night, I did my first test run with this telescope. And it’s just it’s amazing. It’s a celestron origin, which is a smart scope. And so it goes super fast. It knows exactly what it’s looking at it images in real time. So you can watch as the image builds. And and I just I can’t believe how smoothly this went. Normally these things are a technological nightmare. But but last night when I did this first test run, it was incredible. And so hopefully over the coming weeks and months, we will see more and more of these, make them, you know, more interesting, packed with scientists and special guests and more people bringing telescopes to the party. And we can look at different objects and different kinds of telescopes, regular planetary stuff versus deep sky stuff. And, you know, I really hope that will make this just really fun celebration of amateur astronomy that we can just conduct on a on an ongoing basis, as we’ve tried to do over and over again, right. Since 2012. So it really felt like now it’s just minor tweaks and fixes to make this my dream show. So. So if you haven’t checked it out, we can’t wait to check out the sample of it. And but chances are you’ll see me live with this telescope very often in the coming weeks and months.
Dr. Pamela Gay [00:03:04] I am. This is the news I was here to. To to hear. I was here. Yeah.
Fraser Cain [00:03:09] Yeah, yeah. Totally. Yeah. So ISAs you could mission launched last year with the task of mapping the universe in thrilling 3D. They’ve dropped their first preliminary data release containing just 1% of the universe. And so it’s a good time to talk about it. And we’ll talk about it in a second. But it is time for a break.
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Fraser Cain [00:04:31] And we’re back. All right, Pamela. So, I mean, we haven’t gotten the full first data release from Euclid. I think we’re waiting until 2025 for that first drop. But we got enough that I think this falls into the Pamela’s willing to talk about willing to acknowledge the existence of a mission zone. And I’m so excited because I am just stoked on this mission. So what is Euclid?
Dr. Pamela Gay [00:05:00] Euclid is one of the funniest named missions ever that is designed to, over the course of six years, observe roughly a third of the sky. They are specifically looking at parts of the sky that aren’t interrupted by the disk of the Milky Way or other galactic pollution. And they are measuring all the shapes of galaxies out to a distance of about 10 billion light years. Wow. And using this information to map out the distribution of dark matter and to measure the evolution of large scale structure over time.
Fraser Cain [00:05:38] And so let’s talk about sort of its location and position and all that kind of stuff. So where is it?
Dr. Pamela Gay [00:05:44] It is out at L2, the place where we love to stick space telescopes. It’s on that line that goes sun Earth telescopes where it’s gravitationally balanced and hangs out as we go around the sun, far enough away that it’s it’s in constant communication and doesn’t have to deal with a lot of issues from the planet Earth. And it’s not going around and around us. And it just makes everything easier to do science.
Fraser Cain [00:06:15] Right? Look, it puts the earth, the sun and the moon all in one tidy spot in the sky.
Dr. Pamela Gay [00:06:20] Yeah.
Fraser Cain [00:06:20] And so then it can point in the opposite direction and view whatever it wants, and yet can be pointing its antenna back at Earth and and have a continuous view back to the planet. But it doesn’t need that heat now. Block in the way that web does.
Dr. Pamela Gay [00:06:39] Now, it’s it’s living out there simply because that is a very good place to put telescopes. And it actually worked out more beneficially than we could have known before it took off. This is a telescope that getting from idea to where it belongs was a long and storied journey because it was originally put together as a medium class mission idea, while ESA and Roscosmos were still working together. It was originally supposed to be a Roscosmos launch. They then had to partway through construction, go nope, not going to do that. Rejigger things. There’s been a shortage of Aryans. And so they ended up launching on a Falcon nine. They take their 30 day journey, get out where they belong, in the vicinity of the Earth-moon system. And they found on their images this blotch of light that was not intended to be there. And it turned out they actually had a light leak in the side of their telescope.
Fraser Cain [00:07:50] Wow.
Dr. Pamela Gay [00:07:51] And so they had to figure out how do we change the way we’re doing things so that sunlight never directly pours in through the side of the telescope? It was no big deal. They totally did it. But it was just one of these things of, okay, I’m glad it is where it is because there are fewer sources of light to worry about. Yeah, okay. We’re good.
Fraser Cain [00:08:12] There was another challenge that came up. I don’t know if you were watching this, but they were getting condensation inside the optical elements of the telescope. And and this is actually pretty common, like always helps to have the situation because even though you try and build it in the driest environment that you can, you’re still going to get some water vapor from the earth’s atmosphere going into it. And then when you’re out in space in the vacuum of space, then this water vapor evaporates, condenses on to various parts of the optics and starts to decrease the light gathering capability of the spacecraft. And so what’s fascinating about this is that they were ready for this. They knew that this was going to be a problem. They’d seen this happen on other missions. And so they had heaters built in inside their optical pipeline so that they’re able to run the heaters sequentially at the right times and be able to vent out all of that additional water vapor. Once it was out in space and they were able to make that condensation go away and increase the sensitivity of the of the optics by a couple of percent, which is sort of incredible. And I think a lot of other telescope manufacturers will then think about that same strategy. When they build their own missions.
Dr. Pamela Gay [00:09:32] And and I have to admit, now that you’re telling us about it, I had blocked that memory completely. Yeah. And and, yeah, this is just a system that came together, kind of hung out without doing a whole lot of press. And then here’s the the most magnificent image of galaxies ever produced. Yeah. Hi. What do you think of this?
Fraser Cain [00:09:58] All right. We’re going to get to that. But I want to talk about its goals first. And before we even do that, we should stop for another break.
Dr. Pamela Gay [00:10:05] All right.
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Fraser Cain [00:11:08] And we’re back. All right. So what are the science goals of nuclear? What is the what is the purpose of this mission?
Dr. Pamela Gay [00:11:16] Okay. So so goal one is it is going to map out the shape of galaxies out to 10 billion light years away.
Fraser Cain [00:11:26] Yeah.
Dr. Pamela Gay [00:11:27] Now, the reason they are doing this is not just because it’s cool to know the morphologies of galaxies. That’s not actually what they’re trying to do. I It turns out that dark matter has this wonderful little habit of bending light. It still has gravity. You can’t see it, but we measure everything about it through its gravity. And when you have a blob of dark matter between us and a distant galaxy, it will ever so slightly distort that galaxy. And when you look at a large enough sample of galaxies on the sky, you can see, well, this pocket of galaxies should all average out. When you look at all of them to being a circle that’s just on the sky. They should all look like circles. And then it turns out they’re actually teardrop. Then you look over somewhere far away on the sky and another blob of galaxies. And they also should all average out to being a circle. But now they look like an amoeba from your fifth grade science class. And these distortions that we’re seeing are all due to the the dark matter that we don’t see between us and these walls of galaxies distorting what we see. And one of the most amazing things is if we look at a wall of galaxies that are all at a redshift of, say, a half, that is going to allow us to map the dark matter between us, and that we then look at a bunch of galaxies at a redshift of .75. They’re going to have a slightly different distortion that’s due to the nearby dark matter. And the further away and the further and further we look in Redshift, the more dark matter has a chance to distort those galaxies. But because we have this distribution of galaxies all the way out, we can start to uncouple all of this and map in three dimensions what the dark matter is doing to the observed morphologies of galaxies.
Fraser Cain [00:13:32] Right. Right. And so by by measuring, like, really by just looking at the shape of every galaxy that you can see as you see out to that sort of time horizon of 10 billion years, then you are you’re able to then it’s like the example would be like lying at the bottom of a pool of water and looking up at the trees above you and, and and measuring how the shape of the trees look that tells you about the water that’s in between you and the trees. And so in this case, you are by looking at the various blobs that the galaxies have become, you can calculate how much dark matter is in between you and that galaxy where the concentrations are up to a level of accuracy that we’ve never had before. I mean, Hubble does this, Webb does this, but this is a telescope that’s only job really is. Well, I guess half of his households, he will talk about it a second, but but half of its job is to measure, really will allow astronomers to reverse engineer the quantities and locations of dark matter. This thing that is invisible. And yet because we can see its gravity, we can we can see the invisible.
Dr. Pamela Gay [00:14:49] Map out what it’s doing. Yeah. And this was done most notably early on in, in astronomy cast by the Cosmos survey. And I know we both had a my goodness, that model was so amazing and glowing about how awesome it was. And to go in the course of the life of this podcast from a pencil beam survey, able to do this for this small cylinder through the universe, or I guess expanding wedge through the universe to now seeing a spacecraft that’s going to do this over six years to six years for a third of the sky is revolutionary.
Fraser Cain [00:15:28] Yeah, yeah. All right. So that’s half of its job. Yes. Which is which moon? Literally, it has one instrument, a visible light telescope that is taking these pictures of the galaxies and their weird and wonky shapes. Yeah. So it also has an infrared instrument on board. What’s that for?
Dr. Pamela Gay [00:15:45] Well, it has the spectrograph. And. And so it’s this the, the spectrograph is, is the more key part of this. It is measuring the redshift of all of these galaxies, which tells us their relative locations in the sky. And it’s mapping out the change. Large scale structure over the evolution of the universe. And from that 10 billion light years away is Z of about two that it’s starting up until now. Somewhere in that window is where dark energy began to dominate the expansion of the universe where where we went from. Things are expanding away, but getting pulled on by gravity. And it’s the big bang effect. You know, dark energy is now pushing us and accelerating us apart. We’re still trying to come to terms with that.
Fraser Cain [00:16:42] Right? So I want to sort of better understand how this is doing that. So you’ve got this spectrograph on the spacecraft. It’s taking a picture of a galaxy. How does it tell us the redshift of that galaxy and sort of kind of like to tell us how far away because, you know, the same galaxy we see, seeing it close up, it’s just smaller or farther away. It’s just bigger. How do we place that galaxy in that sort of distance slice?
Dr. Pamela Gay [00:17:15] So lucky for us, atoms have these fingerprints of spacings of their atomic lines that are related directly to what is sitting in their core, how many protons, how many neutrons. And these fingerprints are the spacings between the absorption or emission lines, depending on the thermal dynamics of wherever the atoms are located. And when we look at the spectrum of anything, we say, okay, I see these sets of lines and use pattern matching software, or in the case of some brilliant scientist brains to say, this looks like the hydrogen calcium. And you see what the sets of lines that match these must be. And this is this is how originally we figured out quasars were at huge distances because their lines didn’t match nearby stars. And it was a researcher who’s used to thinking about the more distant universe that looked at it and went, those are redshifted lines from something at a great distance that because of the expansion in the universe, has carried what would normally be ultraviolet lines into the optical, what would normally be optical lines into the infrared, or if it’s really far away like ultraviolet lines into the infrared, that can be right.
Fraser Cain [00:18:47] So we so we we look at a galaxy, we use the spectroscope to measure the the absorption lines in that galaxy. And we see three lines in a row with little gaps in between them like, that’s calcium, magnesium and carbon dioxide. We could see their presence in this very recognizable pattern. So how do we get the distance of that galaxy once we have have recognized that fingerprint?
Dr. Pamela Gay [00:19:17] So there there are this this is where it’s it’s still an inexact science because we have to get at it off of other things like supernovae. So going back to Hubble, when we look out at things that we know the distance to due to variable stars or now today other means of standard candles, we say, okay, because I know this object has Luminosity ten and I measure it to have a brightness of 16 and because we’re astronomers, 16 is way fainter than ten. Right? That that amount that it appears to have faded is directly related to its distances, the square of the distance.
Fraser Cain [00:20:08] But you’re also measuring those those absorption lines at a different location when then if the galaxy was right beside us. Right. They’ve been they’ve been redshifted away.
Dr. Pamela Gay [00:20:17] So we have to do two different measurements. So. So if the universe wasn’t expanding, then those lines would be at the exact same wavelength. If the galaxy was 2 billion light years away as it would be if it was right next to us. But what Hubble discovered is if you make a plot of what is the distance to something based on how bright it appears and knowing how luminous it should be, and you look at the chemical signature of its atoms and see how much they have been shifted, the redder the blue, something that has shifted towards the blue. We know and we can do lab experiments with this is moving towards us. Something shifted to the red is moving away from us and it turns out there’s a direct relationship between how much something you should. To the red and how much fainter it appears because of its distance. This is Hubble’s law. It is the linear relationship, we thought, between velocity and and change in brightness. Except then. Then in 1998, the supernova people were like, okay, we’ve got some bad news for you.
Fraser Cain [00:21:33] Right?
Dr. Pamela Gay [00:21:34] The math is so much harder than any of us ever wanted it to be because it turns out that that relationship isn’t actually linear and it isn’t what we had thought, which was things would be slowing down over time. No. Our universe is expanding at an accelerating rate, which no one expected. So we made up words because astronomers do that. And we called whatever is causing the universe to expand apart at an accelerating rate. Dark energy. I can’t tell you why. We just.
Fraser Cain [00:22:05] Know. And I think we all regret the name. But it’s dark. Yeah. And so. And so. That’s the part that’s kind of interesting. Like, one of the big unsolved questions in astronomy in cosmology is, is the amount of dark energy that’s entering the universe a constant? And if it changes over time, you know, what are the implications for the far future of the universe? And the hint that there might be something weird going on is this Hubble tension. And we’ve done whole episodes about this. But but the gist that that you seem to measure the expansion of the universe at different times and it doesn’t match up to standard expansion plus standard amounts of dark energy. Like there’s something weird going on at some point in this process. And, and there has never been an instrument that is more appropriate for for making these exact measurements than than Euclid. It is the machine.
Dr. Pamela Gay [00:22:58] And Euclid is getting at this in an interesting way where it is saying, okay, so we know that that there were these things called baryon acoustic waves in the early universe that caused the initial distribution of matter in our universe to not actually be smooth. There are places that are a little denser. There are places that were a little less dense, more empty. And over time, those regions that were less dense got emptied out as material was pulled out of them and pulled into the more dense regions. And this formed the large scale structure of our universe. And the rate at which that large scale structure formed is one of the things Euclid is directly measuring. It’s looking to see what is the evolving signature of the Baryon acoustic oscillations on the structure of our universe. From what we see in the cosmic microwave background radiation to what we see in the distribution of galaxies changing over time.
Fraser Cain [00:24:01] Yeah. Yeah. And so once it’s performed this survey and done this, as you mentioned, this one third of the entire universe, we will have the the position and composition of billions of objects across the universe telling us with incredible accuracy how much dark matter there is and where it’s located, and then what role dark energy has played throughout the evolving through the entire evolution of the universe as far back as as can be seen this 10 billion years. So so we’re going to talk about the sneak preview that dropped last week in a second. But it’s time for another break.
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Fraser Cain [00:25:50] And we’re back. So Isa dropped this data release, but not a true data release. This was just a sneak preview last week. What was in it?
Dr. Pamela Gay [00:26:00] 1% of the sky.
Fraser Cain [00:26:03] Right.
Dr. Pamela Gay [00:26:05] Just I just it’s like one of the largest single images ever, ever released. A single image is is really the wrong way to put it. One of the largest zoomable contiguous mosaics of images ever released. It is 208 giga pixels and contains 260 observations from March 20th 5th to April 8th. So 208 giga pixels is like a couple weeks of data.
Fraser Cain [00:26:42] Right? There’s what is it, 100 million objects in the pictures.
Dr. Pamela Gay [00:26:48] And they’re there. You can see this what we call the serious of the Milky Way, which is something I have never seen. Visualize this clearly. As someone who did Galaxy surveys, Once upon a time, we were forever looking up and tables of information. What was the amount of stuff between us and the outer edge of our galaxy that would be sign the brightness we measure of those galaxies. This was a coefficient you just looked up and then you adjusted all of your photometry by it. But I had never seen right. Clouds of gas and dust. This here is of our galaxy and it’s just hanging out, shining bright in these extremely sensitive, extremely high resolution images.
Fraser Cain [00:27:39] That’s amazing. Like, imagine you’re. I don’t know, you’re. You’re trying to paint a landscape that is very foggy. Yeah. And the fog is kind of rolling around. The fog doesn’t move. And so you’ve got a a book that you have to look up where you go. If, if you’re looking at the car on in on Third Street, then you just remember that there is that the colors are shifted a little bit and then it’s more of a lime green than it is a green color, whatever. Right.
Dr. Pamela Gay [00:28:11] Exactly.
Fraser Cain [00:28:11] You have to look these up. You really. I know. Look, in this galaxy, what is the amount of possible Milky Way related dust? That’s between me and that object. Okay, here’s a number. Okay. Modify my photometry accordingly. But you’re exactly right. When you look at these pictures, you’re seeing these swirls of of blue gas and dust, which is just part of the Milky Way swirling around. And you could see some objects that are that are not affected by it at all in other cases where they really are affected by just absolutely incredible picture.
Dr. Pamela Gay [00:28:43] Only 32 more percent to go. It’s it’s really wild. And the thing that I’m sure I wrote about long ago and then went, I do not need to worry about this right now and promptly forgot was there was one of the largest cosmological models ever run to simulate what should the distribution of galaxies look like in the Euclid survey? And then you told me before we went live, this is something you’ve done interviews on. And this this man that’s here does way better interviews than I can dream of doing. So just go watch his interviews. So what did you learn about this model I totally forgot about?
Fraser Cain [00:29:26] Yeah. So? So essentially what they did was they. They built they took the like, one of the big simulations they’ve made, I think is the I forget the name of it. The Intel, Elise illustrates. Anyway, researchers have been making these gigantic simulations of chunks of universe. And so what they did was they took one of these chunks of the universe and then they simulated what that would look like as it fell on the sensors of Euclid and specifically, but also, you know, sort of considering other instruments as well, and then provided the the outcome to the scientists and said, you know, when you look at when you look at this Euclid data, this is what it’s going to this is how it’s going to appear in the databases that you’re going to be downloading. And so double check to make sure that that you’re happy with what it is that we’re that we’re observing and then make sure that that you can use the the output data and then use that to kind of calibrate back. And and that was the thing they provided before what they provided last week. Until last week, they provided the real data. And now it’s a matter of checking, you know, comparing the actual results from Euclid compared to what the simulations had said you were going to be expecting. And and there’s just like it’s kind of in. Credible that people are trying to simulate the universe. But also one of the really interesting downstream applications of this is that you can you can give astronomers sample data that is very accurate to what the final instrument is going to be able to produce.
Dr. Pamela Gay [00:31:05] And this also provides a check on our physics, because if it turns out that the the strength of dark energy is varying more than we thought, we will see it as a discrepancy in the rate at which large scale structure forms. And so we’re going to be able to compare these model results with the reality of our universe and say, yes, it looks like we actually got this section of physics correct. We have some errors here. We need to tweak this over here. And it’s getting to the point that we in order to understand if we understand the universe, we have to run complex zillion particle simulations to compare against reality because we’re that in the weeds nowadays and this kind of thing.
Fraser Cain [00:31:59] Yeah, it is amazing. So when should we expect to see more? Like when should we see the real science coming from Euclid?
Dr. Pamela Gay [00:32:06] It’s it depends on what you’re looking for. But I suspect that after every 12 months of data, we’re going to start to see a little bit more science and a little bit more science. And as always, the final results will probably come 2 or 3 years after the survey is complete. And what I’m waiting to see is just how long do they keep this mission going? How long does this telescope work and do we start taking on more of the sky?
Fraser Cain [00:32:37] Yeah, Yeah.
Dr. Pamela Gay [00:32:38] Secondary mission.
Fraser Cain [00:32:40] It’s funny. Like, I’m. I’m trying to line up an interview with someone from the Euclid team, and I know the questions could be, you say six years. You see one third of the sky. But come on. Right. It’s the whole sky, right? Right, Right. So that’s what we want.
Dr. Pamela Gay [00:32:55] Well, not the whole. There’s no reason to do the disk of the Milky Way. We can avoid the disk of the Milky Way. Sure, that’s the full science.
Fraser Cain [00:33:03] But. But. But there’s value in taking pictures of that of the disk of the Milky Way, too. But still, I mean, that’s the part that I think would be would be really interesting. But still, hopefully over the coming years, we will come back again and again talk about what we’ve learned from Euclid in the way we’ve talked about the updates from James T and Hubble and Gaia and other missions out there. So yeah, there’s there’s this is the beginning of what is going to be a really entertaining story for the next decade. So I’m looking forward to it. Thanks, Pamela.
Dr. Pamela Gay [00:33:35] Thank you, Fraser, And thank you to everyone out there who is part of our Patreon community. We can’t thank all of you by name, but we do take on a group of the $10 a month and up patrons every week. If you want to hear me say your name, I’m going to be running the November names at the end of the week, so join the patron this week. I would like to specifically thank Andrew Stevenson, Astro Bob Astro Sets. Brenda. Brian Cagle. Brian Kelby Bruce. Amazing. Daniel Loosely Davids is astronaut Don Mons, Elliott Walker, Father Practical and McDavid. Greg Davies. Gregory Singleton. Hal McKinney. Jeff Dave. Jeff Collins. Jeff Wilson. Jeremy Kerwin. Joanne Mulvey. Joe Holstein. John Hayes. Jonathan Poe. Jordan Turner. J.P. Sullivan. Clum. Basil Wild Love Science. Christiane Magers Holt. Consi Hope and Franco. Larry Vogt. Lee Harben. Lou Zeeland. Mark Steven Resnick. Mike Heidi Nyla. Noah Albertson. Paul L. Hayden. Robbie The Dog with the Dot. Robert Cordova. Robert Plasma, SCO and the Scott Bieber. Sean Matt. Stephen White The Air Major. The Big Squish Squash. The Lonely Seven Person. Thomas Gazi The Time Lord IRA Trick or Will Hamilton and Zero Chill. Thank you all so much.
Fraser Cain [00:35:03] Thanks, Ron. And we’ll see you next week.
Dr. Pamela Gay [00:35:05] Bye bye. Astronomy cast is a joint product of Universe today and the Planetary Science Institute. Astronomy Cast is released under a Creative Commons attribution license. So love it. Share it and remix it. But please credit it to our hosts Fraser Cain and Dr. Pamela Gay. You can get more information on today’s show topic on our website. Astronomy Cavs.com. This episode was brought to you. Thanks to our generous patrons, unpatriotic. If you want to help keep the show going. Please consider joining our community at Patriot E-commerce slash astronomy cast. Not only do you help us pay our producers a fair wage, you will also get special access to content right in your inbox and invites to online events. We are so grateful to all of you who have joined our Patreon community already. Anyways, keep looking up. This has been astronomy cast.
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Fraser Cain [00:36:58] Even if your credit isn’t the cute.
Dr. Pamela Gay [00:37:00] Hashtag credit not you.
Fraser Cain [00:37:01] Visit the car lot on Speedway one block west of Craig Croft or at save the.
Speaker 3 [00:37:05] Day.com.
Dr. Pamela Gay [00:37:05] Got it. Save the day.com.
Fraser Cain [00:37:07] The car lot the dealership people.
Dr. Pamela Gay [00:37:08] Trust.